Legion TD 1100+ rule-change suggestion

[Hutzu]

Hi guys and gals,

as it is mostly agreed upon, judging by my own experience and from what I've heard, LIHL rules are usually applied on the 1100+ bot.
Now a full-assimilation was denied here: https://entgaming.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=44582
Which also makes sense to me, because in LIHL we adjust the stats by giving the disconnecter a penalty and the rest gets a bonus to even things out
(2s: 1x -18, 3x +6; 3s: 1x -20, 5x +4; 4s: 1x -21, 7x +3). But in public we don't do that as the system is different.

Now I would like to know from the players, who regularly or occasionally play the 1100+ bot, would you like the modified rules to apply or keep the public rules?

Modified = All LIHL rules except the draw. People can still agree upon a draw, which I find very nice, but they aren't forced.
So that would mean:
-No merc
-No anti-stuck unless creeps are stuck
-No cross
-No mid-build
-No aura-swap
-No building at areas (dark greenish area) where your towers could attack the leaks of your ally or even before he leaks (though we wont be 'that' strict about that one - like in LIHL - if it is just barely used)

@nabo. Feel free to move this to suggestion, if you think it is more suited for there. I thought putting in here might be better as this is for Legion TD only and might be found by the players more easily as maybe not all LTD-members check out the suggestion-section.

[godlik3]

if they want to play lihl rules just apply for lihl....or thats gonna be another lihl but with worse players...
1100 is making succes cuz they can or not play like they want =)

[Hutzu]

If LIHL rules applied by default, it can be used to recruite some of them to LIHL and/or we can ask for 1100 bot replays at vouch requests.
Also the players get a more accustomed to LIHL, if they want to apply. If they don't, it wont change so much for them anyway, as they keep agreeing on those rules most of the times.

[nabo.]

if they want to play lihl rules just apply for lihl...

Valid point.

It depends what you guys want this bot to be: a bit more advanced pub lvl bot or a bot to help pubs transition to lihl.

---------------------------------------------------
-No anti-stuck unless creeps are stuck
-No cross

-I think we should keep AS rules same as the normal LTD bot.
-No cross: I like no cross. But, since its a pub bot, people may still want to cross. If we can make it a no-cross without losing the existing playerbase, Im all for it.

[SLSGuennter]

i would say, it should be kept like this, but if 6 or more agree to lihl rules in lobby, then all play like this.
nearly all games are played with rules there anyway, the only problem is the draw from time to time, but i think its not possible to make a "must draw" rule there, cause to much people would start to pp, since u dont lose elo due to dc-penalty like in lihl (hutzu already explained)
keep it like it is, and its wonderfull ... from time to time its also funny to play cross or merc or something, and its better against strong enemy then against 900elo players without a clue

[Krumme]

my vote would be to make it LIHL to avoid any confusion. far too often lately i have seen reports and stuff about players not following up on their "agreement" to play by LIHL's rules, but it is basically assumed by the majority of the players anyways. so it only takes 1 or 2 people to set everything off and create e-drama. the best solution is to keep players who wanna mega on the mega bot, and let 1100+ be a more serious type of bot. i'm sure everyone would be okay with it, though some will obviously not like it at first. thinking it's for the greater good though

This.
Mods basically create rules to make it easier for the players - and if the situation is as described, that people feel left behind because it's gentlemen agreement and not actual rules it should be changed - especially if the LIHL rules is actually being played more often than the real rules

[I_kill_satan]

1. We already had no cross bot, it died.
2. If people with rating want play cross vs cross or solo vs cross why not.
3. If someone cheat with gentleman agreement its not a big deal in context of gameplay, its not a huge disbalance, but his reputation will suffer and most likely nobody strong will agrees to play with him in future.

So, imo, currently no need extra rules for this bot

[donewithdota]

I have been playing pub LTD for way too long....but i am still intimidated by LIHL. So I am in agreement with Hutzu,the 1100 bot would be more conceptually suited to being a transition bot from pub to LIHL style play. Since we already have pub bot, and since a few lihl players i think stop by the 1100 bot its a nice way to move to a more structured game with experienced players (perhaps less freedom but more skill for sure)....leaving the status quo as is would be ambiguous and detrimental to player base...without strict LIHL rules enforced there is no integrity left. Even tho we are pub...we do have integrity ok =P

The status quo involves constant questioning everyone in lobby if they agree to lihl and to no purpose because agreements are not binding.

Btw, Im curious why the rule in LIHL regarding not ever attacking ally creeps in opposite lane is not enforced and or ambiguous...it seems clear cut to me....build far enough so that there is no possibility of you ever catching ally creeps. Please enlighten why this rule has gray area....

So i voted LIHL 1100 all teh way.........make it happen =)

[Hutzu]

@donewithdota The "grey area" is because of this: Unit is on dark-green area, but just barely. Let's say a full tower-spot (speaking 2 squares). But in front of it there are other towers. Now the first row of towers are attacked and the units, which are in dark-green area, move forward and thus are out of reach again from the middle.

Personally I don't like to see any more than 1.5 tower spots (speaking 3 squares) to be used of that area. At the very most 2 towers spots at 20+ levels.
If you have Zeus or Melilai, it can happen that you attack your ally's leaks, even if you don't touch that area, because the range of those towers are just insane.

[nabo.]

@hutzu

Moved topic to suggestion.

Lets see if there r more responses.

[aRt)Y]

Poll will be closed on the 20th of Dec.

[BeepBoopBeep]

Rule's should be kept same as the public bot

[MarshMallows]

why? there is an unwritten rule not to cross aura swap antistick or double build also mostly people draw when there is a dc pre 20, a leaver is different... only noob who wouldnt draw for me was rocknrolled and he lost with 4 vs our 3 on 20.

[aRt)Y]

Suggestion denied. Public rules remain.
http://i.imgur.com/K4HSSbh.png

[aRt)Y]

Rules have been changed based on staff vote: http://wiki.entgaming.net/index.php?title=EntG ... &oldid=768
To be enforced starting 1/6/15