ENT Gaming

I guess we came to a consent to disable the stats command for Island Defense until neco has finished the map.
viewtopic.php?f=80&t=8675&start=70#p52613

If someone is still against it, he shall speak.

No one is against it. And if someone is against it, his opinion doesn't matter. The majority of people here want ELO gone.

TimmyTheTauren wrote:art, don't be mad cause your elo bad.

No disable pls

o.O

Timmy has yet not given any valid argument for the keeping the stats except saying the public players would improve which is
I. simply wrong because there's no improvement
II. you can't even prove it but see I.

Plus, Timmy doesn't have a neutral view on the things since he's totally affected by his elo.

uakf.b wrote:If people start to really care about their stats then it could certainly become a problem in a unbalanced-team-size game like Island Defense (or tree tag).

Withered wrote:No one is against it. And if someone is against it, his opinion doesn't matter. The majority of people here want ELO gone.

I guess there's a flaw in your sentence.

Stats is fine as long as it doesn't cause desyncs. It makes the game more competitive for the people that care, possibly having more people taking the game more seriously. Your reasons for removing stats were not plausible, the only reason why stats would be removed if it was causing desyncs. Players like Plus. and Timmy probably worked pretty hard to get top ELO, that's why they definitely will not be happy if stats was removed.

When I was playing a few weeks ago, fatal errors and desyncs weren't that common, so it's just down to whether the new changes have caused too many desyncs/fatals.

-Burn

I am actually lmfao @Withered, "No opinion but art and I matters, no one else gets a say. The majority of people want ELO gone. (aka art I)"

No one else has said anything besides you and art. Sure people have pointed out some flaws in the stats, but that doesn't mean they want the stats to be removed. As I said before, people either don't care about ELO or don't know what it is. That is NOT the same as being against it, rofl.

Withered, so far all I see for your reasoning is because you got pub stomped by an alt that wouldn't tell you his main. (It was me, your only reasoning is now invalid, good day) LEGIT.

aRt)Y, all I see for your reasoning is that "I can stack with my euros and win every game." Good to be you, go ahead and do it.

The main aspects for removing stats (in my opinion):
• no balance
when has there ever been balance in the first place

• too many bugs
ditto to above, always been bugs in ID, as well as most of the bugs in stats being fixed, haven' had a faulty loss in a very long time (aside from lag-outs and the three leaver ruler)

• people caring too much about stats than about the game
elaborate on why caring about the stats ruins the game, the object of the game is to kill the titan and his minions, how you achieve the goal shouldn't matter, assuming you follow the rules in the process

• no progress since they get pub stumped (e.g. PLus.) -> frustrated -> worse -> want to play vs dler -> PLus using alts -> circle begins from new
as plus said before this has always happened, nothing new to the stats

If it causes mass desyncs, I would agree to having to shut them off until a better system is made. However, I don't see mass desyncs, I see a few and an explanation from uakf.b that stats are not even causing it.



tl:dr - I haven't seen more than two people say they are completely against it and want it removed. Even if you showed me ten people, what kind of majority is that? How many unique players are there? 2000?

TimmyTheTauren wrote:Withered, so far all I see for your reasoning is because you got pub stomped by an alt that wouldn't tell you his main. (It was me, your only reasoning is now invalid, good day) LEGIT.
?

You honestly think you are the only person pub stomping with alts?

Your explanation isn't any better, timmy...

"We add stats because it's bugged but who cares because ID is bugged anyway."
"We add stats for an unbalanced game because ID is unbalanced anyway."

The pub stomping has nothing to do with the stats itself. I am talking about the progress aka public players actually getting BETTER because of STATS but stats won't help them nor will they achieve a higher skill level. If you truly believe pub players improve then... stop afking and play.

It will most likely make them QQ and RQ even more than they currently are. Or what's the reason for playing on alts? Pubs not knowing who they are playing against.
It has and will always be the idea behind alts - to be anonymous and to stomp because stats would reveal yourself to be 'good'.

Your argumentation hasn't disproved anything from me and only because pubs don't post something, it doesn't mean they wouldn't think so.

Plus, I actually don't care about them because 98% of them can't play the basics of ID. If they wish to change something, they would participate like on BGN, ID, MBOT and now ENT and actually improve on their own instead of ridiculous numbers.

So you want stats permanently disabled, right? Not temporarily I assume then?

@uakf.b aRt)Y and Withered do, who seem to think they are "most people". However no, I personally, as well as others do not want them removed.

@Withered The case you specifically complained about was me, I never said I was the only person pub stomping.

@aRt)Y I am not saying lets add to the pile of bugs, I'm saying your argument isn't convincing because bugs are already present. My other statement is saying ID is already an unbalanced game, it is not the stats that is making it unbalanced. You seem to blame all of ID's original problems on stats now.

You say stats will cause pubs to quit, that is simply absurd. If they choose to quit from being pub stomped, they will quit regardless of stats. You are basing that whole argumentation on improving the player base, even though you mentioned you didn't care. How will no stats vs stats improve anything? Do you not think wanting to have better stats will not make them strive to be a better player? Are you simply stuck on people quitting? If people are going to quit because of something as silly as that, as I said before, it is better to weed them out now.

You say stats won't help them get better, however I say no stats doesn't make a difference in the matter either.

Your argumentation isn't any different than mine, we are both saying the opposite of the same things. When we argue about the same things in an opposite sense how is my side any less prominent than yours? You haven't listed anything that isn't related to the growth of pubs, when in reality stats vs no stats will make no difference except for in the players who care about stats. If a player cares about stats, what PLus and I have been telling you will be correct, they will try to get better in order to have better stats. Again, the keyword is try, I'm not saying they will drastically improve, I'm saying they will try if they care. With no stats however, nothing changes. You are saying having no stats will make a difference in growth, when simply put, no evidence or proof is there as well as no logical explanation as to why no stats could possibly help any growth in the player base aside from your ridiculous assumption that everyone will quit.


So basically - Your only "valid arguments" are "people will somehow only have a chance of improving without stats vs. with stats" and "people will quit because of people pubstomping with alts with stats, but obv will have a decreased affect if there are no stats"

#freelo

There's a lot of unfounded speculation occurring in these arguments, don't presume anything from other players perspectives.
If you have a credible reason for having the stats removed you should state it as your own opinion instead of blowing it out of proportion and presuming a point of view for all the Pubs. You are not the Pub Whisperer, and you will never be able to comprehend what goes on in the mind of pub. Pubs are better left to their own devices or ignored as background noise.

Jokes aside, I see no harm in keeping the stats. If you care about them, then you will improve your stats, if you don't then you can simply ignore them completely. It's a bonus feature after all, no one is forcing you to pay attention to these stats. I'm aware that they are flawed (and irrelevant), but I'd rather have something flawed than nothing at all.

So you don't have any better system of determining winners (i.e., you think any stats system for ID will be flawed)?

We suggested many ideas on the main thread, the dilemma is, is it possible to code into the system?

Okay, let me give my whole opinion on this matter, and I'll try to keep it as accurate as possible.

I will split people into these categories:

1) One who doesn't care about idstats at all, and will not care if it exists or not.
2) One who does not know about the existence of idstats.
3) One who plays despite of idstats since he/she cares about his/her idstats and dislikes pub stompers and inaccurate idstats.
4) One who plays for the stats ELO, W/L, K/D, etc. and compete with others' stats.

All of the above will be concerned about idstats causing desyncs/fatal errors, but this hasn't been confirmed to happen often enough to become a real issue.

Let's categorise the main points from the three players had to say given from Plus., Art)y and TimmyTheTauren.

I know for sure that Plus. and TimmyTheTauren both belong in no. 4). They want IDstats to stay.

Judging Art)y, he is someone who haven't played much games, and doesn't like the idstats, so I'd put him under 3).

The others haven't given enough info. for me to classify them, but it's merely a battle of these two groups, 3) and 4).

For the argument of group 3), they don't want to ruin their street rep. because of faulty stats and pub stompers.

For the argument of every other group, we will tell you to suck it up and play, you can even ask devs to clear stats or just play on an alt.

-Burn