Top players list

[Naruto-fr]

Personally , I play in the 2 modes. Usually EM is filled faster because many people don't want to play a long game. But that is true that in EM mode even noobs can win vs good players if they pick OP heroes. Anyway, ofc the top players have stacked sometimes. Otherwise it will take many years to be on the top. But most of them are also really good players.

[Chantry]

Lol it is flawed, loo at me for instance, i hae about 2.2k elo and i've played only em forever. Maybe a few non-em mainly -cm if not em. I'm like top 25 and i'm going to be randomlly put in the top ten now for the em ladder because i've been playing em only... Tbh i don't think thats fair even though it puts me higher, i'm 100% not as good as most of the top ten players and i've played many times with them all... So please tell me how its more balanced if i'm gonna catapult up in rank above people better than me in the em ladder...??

[Fangorn]

That would be a part of the change, there would be rotations within the stats.
And btw, you're at 2081, not 2.2k. While I'm at it, compare stats again plox?

[Chantry]

That would be a part of the change, there would be rotations within the stats.
And btw, you're at 2081, not 2.2k. While I'm at it, compare stats again plox?

Ya 2081 atm. I usually hover 2.2k - 2.3k but i lost a few and i don't have a computer to play on atm in order to win my elo back to where it should be. I'm at a all time low for the year atm :/

[ipwnipwn]

kurosaki- isnt inactive for real life things, he just playing dota 2 i see him online on steam all the time, im pretty sure he dont care about his ent stats, and flowersonw said he will be back soon, islow.. too bad for him anyway if he inactive someday some1 will take his spot xD

[Chantry]

kurosaki- isnt inactive for real life things, he just playing dota 2 i see him online on steam all the time, im pretty sure he dont care about his ent stats, and flowersonw said he will be back soon, islow.. too bad for him anyway if he inactive someday some1 will take his spot xD

And you yaphs?? Your main will be knocked down too... You don't care?

[EdgeOfChaos]

Okay, kurosaki is playing dota 2, still doesn't mean he should lose his ent stats. He earned it, it would be stupid to take it away.

Btw there was already discussion about whether top 10 players should lose their rank if they go inactive, and we said no:
viewtopic.php?f=14&t=6328

This will ruin the stats of players who couldn't have known to do anything differently, so this should be rejected.

[Fangorn]

I thought everyone had realized that there would be rotations within the statslist. The current players on top of the list, might face changes, yes. But they won't "lose" their stats, they will probably be on top of the easymode list anyway, since all of them play easymode. So nothing will be "taken away". I don't see how this change would "ruin" anything.

The pros has already been mentioned several times. And also, the poll speak for itself

[EdgeOfChaos]

The poll had biased questions and took place before the discussion about this came up. Try starting a new one now with "Yes" and "No". I will accept the results from that, and if a majority want it, I won't argue if this gets approved.

The "rotations in the top 10" you reference are just ruining people's stats for no reason. Yes, this is ruining stats. How can you not see that dividing someone's elo in half is not ruining their stats? Would you like it if we decided that we'll have two separate statpages for Fangorn, so suddenly you have 1500 elo? I doubt you would.

Bottom line, punishing players who earned their elo legitimately because they played two different modes is a terrible, terrible idea.

[Fangorn]

That would apply for those who play 50/50 if -em and non-em. Most players on the toplist are easymoders. The ordinary pubber might play more or less 50/50, but that would be a change he would have to accept.
I still don't see how this change would "ruin" anything

[BurritoCarcass]

Even though I agree with this, implementing it would difficult and time consuming. I tried to argue that people that haven't played an ent game in months should have their stats cleared, but they didn't buy that either, which I understand. I withdraw my initial opinion on this subject, the top ten players is reserved for the people with highest elo on ent, regardless of the game mode they play. A few guys in top 20 play apem a-bal games, which is significantly harder than ap or apem do to the team arrangements. Yes people playing EM can climb faster, but does the elo really matter anyway? I do agree that it is nice to see accomplishing stats and whatnot, but 90% of people stack to get their elo anyway. Only the people that play a-bal earn their elo with the highest integrity, since it is impossible to stack. I know I play most ap games with at least one friend, but that is because its more fun and it also helps ensure that there is one less person that could possibly be throwing the game. I know you are not a fan of stacking at all, I've played with you many times (ProudSmurf) and I understand where you are coming from, this suggestion has great points, but also has many flaws that would have to be reworked. I have no idea how there would be a sorting system that literally scans every ent player and readjusts their stats to accomodate a top ten list for em and non-em. It's a bit farfetched (POKEMON REFERENCE FOR THE WIN).

[EdgeOfChaos]

I brought up three examples of people who play almost completely half and half. Check Flowersnow. The others are somewhat inactive, but they do play both modes.

@BurritoCarcass, the elo does matter to some people.. that's why they put in the effort to stack teams and get on the top 10. And this would be revoking that achievement from a few people when they have done nothing wrong.

@Fangorn, you might not care if people lost a bunch of their stats because you only play one mode, but I play whichever mode has more players and will start soon in it, which means I play both em and non-em and I would care if I lost some stats because we divide the stats page into 2.

And why would that be a change "he just has to accept"? He has done nothing wrong against the rules, we have no right to change his stats randomly.

And it would ruin the top 10 list because the people who legitimately deserve to be there and play some of both modes would be kicked out and a bunch of lower elo players who only play one mode (like you) would get kicked up in ranking even though they don't deserve it.

[BurritoCarcass]

I agree. There is so fair way to handle this issue. There are so many factors to account for and Edge is absolutely right, people should not be penalized for trying to get the most games for their time. In my opinion, let only Em people revel in their success, they will never be as good as the people that excel in non-em. Inhouse games aren't hosted in EM and personally, at this point, that is what I am playing for. Elo is nice and all, but in my opinion, it doesn't mean anything if you don't earn it the right way, which is by just being better.

[Fangorn]

"bunch of lower elo players who only play one mode"? This suggestion is based upon the idea that the players who only wish to stomp noobs in easymode, gets their own statslist. And the other ones, who want to play somewhat serious dota, gets their own statslist - for standard dota. No stats gets deleted, only divided.

[BurritoCarcass]

But how would someone separate it? How could someone/something possible sort through so many users and then split their games total/elo. It just seems impossible.